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Hard core, or Soft Core - What do you want Descent to be?


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Poll: Hard core or soft core (lol - like easier) (23 member(s) have cast votes)

What style of game would you like to see Desent (2019) being?

  1. Hard Core - where you can get lost in the tunnels and have to figure puzzles and maps out on your own (16 votes [69.57%])

    Percentage of vote: 69.57%

  2. Soft Core - where you get lead to where you need to go to accomplish your goal (7 votes [30.43%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.43%

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#1
Wingman

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I am curious about one thing - we have had some debate recently internally about whether the game is better off being hard and challenging, where you can get lost in the mines and have pressures to figure out puzzles, routes and unlocks, or would you rather have tons of hints that lead you along?

 

 

Let us know your thoughts below.

 

 

Thanks.

WM

 


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#2
PyroJockey

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x2

Personally I like the hard core, but I think the difficulty levels need to be adjusted so the entry level will be a learning experience for the new players, but It should be boring to a 6DOF veteran who would normally play a higher level.   


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#3
Wingman

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Well yeah the difficulty settings are not honed in yet.

WM


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#4
aliengen

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Challenging and complex maps really appeal to me, particularly finding keys and the countdown when reaching the exit. If i were a designer I'd create a mine map that had a near impossible escape route with robots littering your path, while the ship becomes increasingly harder to pilot.
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#5
Lithari81

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I would recommend a third option, where you can choose, maybe a device on your ship which you can turn on or off and it guides you the way out....IF you choose to activate it.

 

So, for those that want to find their own way, won't activate it, those that might need to use it, will.

 

Everyone is happy.


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#6
Wingman

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I would recommend a third option, where you can choose, maybe a device on your ship which you can turn on or off and it guides you the way out....IF you choose to activate it.

 

So, for those that want to find their own way, won't activate it, those that might need to use it, will.

 

Everyone is happy.

 

I do like options but that would cost them some score, there are consequences for your actions young man!

 

:)

WM


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#7
defcon_x

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I like the originals where the puzzles can be complex but the enemies are fun to plow through until you get to a boss.

 

However I like the idea of all enemies being like mini bosses in a way too. Memorable encounters. Requires more trial. Whatever the new gamers want!


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#8
Hunter

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You're asking this NOW?

 

Personally I think Descent levels flow better when the puzzles are simple. You should leave the complicated and hard puzzles to secrets - some should be easy, some should be hard. You don't want to bog down regular players with complex puzzles if it's part of mission objectives. Bonus objectives? Sure - But not primary objectives. Making encounters hard is fine too on the higher levels.

 

Also for AI, don't make the mistake Descent 3 did by vastly increasing the hitpoints of enemies based on difficulty. Too much HP to grind through on small and fast objects is boring, or results in hitscan weapons being the only weapon of choice against certain opponents. Descent largely made changes to the speed and effectiveness of robots on higher difficulties. Faster weapons, faster firing rates, better accuracy, more agility, better 'senses' etc.


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#9
RocketMan

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You're asking this NOW?

 

Personally I think Descent levels flow better when the puzzles are simple. You should leave the complicated and hard puzzles to secrets - some should be easy, some should be hard. You don't want to bog down regular players with complex puzzles if it's part of mission objectives. Bonus objectives? Sure - But not primary objectives. Making encounters hard is fine too on the higher levels.

 

Also for AI, don't make the mistake Descent 3 did by vastly increasing the hitpoints of enemies based on difficulty. Too much HP to grind through on small and fast objects is boring, or results in hitscan weapons being the only weapon of choice against certain opponents. Descent largely made changes to the speed and effectiveness of robots on higher difficulties. Faster weapons, faster firing rates, better accuracy, more agility, better 'senses' etc.

What he said - ^^^


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#10
Splotchie

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This is the wrong question.  Descent is a class of its own.  No really.

It's a game that wants you to think in completely different ways from how you naturally do.  That's never going to be immediately intuitive for a player who's starting it for the first time, no matter how you decide to introduce it to them.  Neurologically, the brain needs time and practice to form those new connections and it's going to depend at least a little on the player's age and how much "exercise" they give their brain on a regular basis as well.

This is going to be as much an issue of neuroplasticity for new players as it is one of difficulty.

 

So you can try to ease the player into it but don't coddle them so much you give them the option of not learning, because they won't.  The brain doesn't naturally rearrange itself when it doesn't have a reason to.  If you want to include some harder puzzles, make like Portal and focus them around the game's central mechanics (in this case, that's zero-gravity movement) so the player comes away from each one with a better understanding of the game as a whole.


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#11
Wingman

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Just wanted some confirmation....on what we already knew.

 

smile.png

 

And this was to settle an argument with people NEW to the genre - we did it on FB too and together it is more than 80% in the challenging category.

WM


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#12
Obi-Wan Kenobi

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Well if it were to be like Descent 2, as in well balanced and with game modes Co-Op players as well as 4v4 team players and 1v1 players can advance from, 
Survival with different maps would also be very welcome..

But yeah, so far I found Descent 2 the best 6DoF of all time, so I am hoping Descent Underground  aka Descent 2019 will be something like my old experience with Descent 2.


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#13
Doglman

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The game should to be accessible to everyone, so a hint/help system needs to exist. However, hints must be timely and applicable to not be obnoxious, *especially* if the hints take the form of text on a screen. For skilled players, the hints they see should be infrequent and discreet. For new players, the quantity and type of hints should adapt based on how well the player is performing the current task.

 

Of course I want engaging content! I just want help when I need it.


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#14
Wingman

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We have hints in the levels to help people, we are generally aiming for a more challenging experience......there may be some frustration at times but that makes the discovery process that much more rewarding.

We are all old school developers - we prefer a challenging adventure - over one that is too easy.

 

WM


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#15
inspades

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How about both?

 

The D2/D3 guidebot was great at this very thing.

If you wanted, you could not use it and figure everything out yourself. Or, have it lead you to everything.

It was left to the player


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#16
Wingman

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How about both?

 

The D2/D3 guidebot was great at this very thing.

If you wanted, you could not use it and figure everything out yourself. Or, have it lead you to everything.

It was left to the player

 

I think if you try to be everything to everyone, your game suffers, not saying that happened then.....and we certainly can't do Guidebot quickly, maybe as an expansion later - but there are other things we can do to reward the SP experience.

WM


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#17
pipsqueak

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I'm partial to hard core.  Tons of hints make the game a little too boring for my taste.  But appealing to a broad audience, I think maybe a bit of progression might keep a player interested in staying with the game.  For the beginning level or two, maybe some hints to drive the player to keep his/her head in the game.  If its too challenging from the get-go, the player may lose interest and just put the game down.  Keeping it simple in the beginning a player gets that satisfaction of solving the puzzles and getting rewarded.  Once a player gets a feel for the game and invests a couple levels into it a more challenging game with fewer hints may be a bit more appealing and fun. 


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#18
PyroJockey

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x2

 

I think maybe a bit of progression might keep a player interested in staying with the game.  For the beginning level or two, maybe some hints to drive the player to keep his/her head in the game.  If its too challenging from the get-go, the player may lose interest and just put the game down.  Keeping it simple in the beginning a player gets that satisfaction of solving the puzzles and getting rewarded.  Once a player gets a feel for the game and invests a couple levels into it a more challenging game with fewer hints may be a bit more appealing and fun. 

 

A wise man once said, "The first crack rock is free".


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There are times you strive for greatness, to reach lofty goals and accomplish

noble deeds. Then there’s the rest of the times you just want to blow stuff up.
jgrs60.jpg

Note: Everything I post is as a fan of Descent: Underground except for off-color statements - which will be written in PyroJockey Plum.





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